CRPS and Refinement with Benjamin Buckland

Pain can make you feel like your whole life has been reduced to symptoms, setbacks, and survival. Ben Buckland’s (Tried by Fire Podcast) story refuses that ending. After a workplace injury, Ben develops CRPS (Complex Regional Pain Syndrome), one of the most severe chronic pain conditions, and he describes what it’s like to live with a nervous system stuck in fight-or-flight, unpredictable flare-ups, and sleep that never feels like rest.

We talk through the real-world side of chronic pain management: the overwhelm of medication overload, the hard work of self-advocacy, and the practical experiments that actually moved the needle for him, including a Mediterranean diet that turned into a more holistic nutrition approach, low dose naltrexone (LDN), and the surprising impact of an H-Wave device compared with a standard TENS unit. Ben also explains how an exoskeleton-style brace and other assistive devices help him walk by shifting weight-bearing, plus the emotional challenge of learning to trust support when your body feels unreliable.

But the heart of the conversation is faith under pressure. Ben shares the turning point from demanding “Why, God?” to asking “How can I glorify You in the middle of this?” and how gratitude, worship, counseling, and Scripture reshaped his identity. We also get honest about marriage and parenting with chronic illness, repairing relationships after pain-driven reactions, and how recovery from pornography addiction connected to learning his worth as God’s beloved child.

If you’re looking for Christian chronic illness encouragement, CRPS awareness, chronic pain resources, and a grounded story of hope that doesn’t deny reality, this one is for you. Subscribe, share with a friend who needs it, and leave a review to help more listeners find these stories.

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Transcript

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Welcome And Meet Ben

SPEAKER_01 0:01

I'm your Jesus loving and pote host, Ellie Sprague. Welcome to Christians with Chronic Illnesses. Thanks, Ben, for being on Christians with Chronic Illnesses. I'm so happy to have you. Yeah, Ben Buckland, right? Yeah, I'm super honored to have you. Tell us a little about yourself, Ben.

SPEAKER_00 0:32

Well, I'm a dad, so that's fun. I uh have three boys, so my house can be kind of chaotic at times.

SPEAKER_03 0:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

I uh I often refer to them as my horde of ravenous locusts because they eat everything and so it's crazy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:47

Phenomenal. What a nickname. Tree of locusts.

SPEAKER_00 0:51

I mean, it's very, it's very true. They eat everything.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

How old are they?

SPEAKER_00 0:55

Eight, five, and eighteen months.

SPEAKER_02 0:59

They eat that much of their not even teenagers yet.

SPEAKER_00 1:02

No, it's crazy. My eight-year-old is up to my chest. It's it's wild. Like he could pass for a 10 or 12-year-old. It's wild.

SPEAKER_02 1:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:11

Yeah. He's tall, but I'm also tall, so he kind of gets it from me.

SPEAKER_01 1:15

Right. Very sweet. So you have three kids, a wife.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

Yeah. So we've been married here in July, it'll be 12 years.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Wow. Congrats.

SPEAKER_00 1:25

It's a long time.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Yeah, that is.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Trying to think. I think it's 12 years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:29

Aww. That's exciting. Congrats. That's really sweet. You also have some pretty

Tried By Fire Vision

SPEAKER_01 1:35

exciting upcoming projects you're working on. Yeah. Do you want to tell us a little bit about those?

SPEAKER_00 1:40

Yeah. I mean, so I am currently running a Kickstarter. Depending on whenever this airs, it may still be up. It may be down. If it's down, you can always go back. And there's like you can still essentially pre-order the book that I'm writing. Or if you choose to support the podcast I'm starting, you can do that too.

SPEAKER_03 1:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:57

But the name of that's called Tried by Fire or the Tried by Fire podcast. And then I'm writing a book with the same title just because it's more of a play onto my diagnosis. And I can get into that a little bit later. But working on those things. So I've been pretty busy trying to finish the book and then working on different episodes, trying to kind of get like a season arc of where I want to go, what I want to do, and then trying to plan different people that I'm interviewing and where to place them throughout the year. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:28

Yeah. So for anyone listening, who what kind of people are you looking to interview in case someone's listening and like, oh, that sounds really interesting.

SPEAKER_00 2:35

Yeah. Honestly, it's like how have you gone through something, whether it's like a trial or abuse or depression or suffering? And what did God teach you in that moment, in that season? And then how can you use that to then impact other people and then encourage them to be able to essentially do kind of the same thing that I'm doing, which is to share my story, to encourage others, because I have hope in Jesus. And there are people in this world that don't have the same hope that I do, that are suffering in silence and have no hope. So my end goal is like I want people to have a place where they can come onto a platform where I just talk with them about what they've gone through. Then they can share, or I can kind of ask them some questions about what did God teach you in that moment? And because oftentimes when I went through my accident and everything, I I looked at it as a curse. I didn't look at it as a blessing. And it took me a really long time to have a change of perspective. And that perspective only came from God. And I want there to be a place where people can hear those kinds of stories of, hey, I went through this, God taught me this, God is still good regardless of it. And then how can I encourage other people that might be going through the same thing or through similar things?

SPEAKER_01 4:01

Yeah. So you're not even looking specifically for medical illness issues. It could be trauma, abuse, things like that, and how Christ kind of brought you through that fire.

SPEAKER_00 4:11

Oh, absolutely. And I think it's because oftentimes we like to shy away from the things that are real, you know? Like I didn't want to talk about what happened to me for so long because I didn't want people to pity me.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

I didn't want people to look at me. Yeah, a charity case.

SPEAKER_00 4:26

Yeah, like a charity case or less than. And that's that's more the reason why I did a Kickstarter instead of a GoFundMe. I didn't want people to just be like, here's money. I wanted them to get something out of it too. It makes me feel better about it in the sense that I didn't want people to just give me things and I wanted to give them something back in return.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

Yeah, that's so cool.

Sharing Stories Without Pity

SPEAKER_01 4:45

So your book and your podcast. So for the book, is it autobiographical?

SPEAKER_00 4:52

So it was at the very beginning. And like I I was I've been writing it since my accident. Essentially, I started journaling what was happening, and then those journals became the base of the book. So then I started essentially fleshing out like everything as far as like the details of what was happening and when it was happening, what it was feeling like going through what I went through at those specific times. And that sort of just translated into basically like the full working, I'd say rough draft of my book. And then as God started to move in me in my life, I was like, okay, look, this is this is great. Like I'm recounting all of these events and how like how bad it really was. Because when I think about it now, it wasn't as bad as what I remember writing down. And I and after revisiting it, I'm like, oh my goodness, it was really that bad. And then my whole point was that as God started to change me, is so did my book, is it started becoming less about me and more about God.

SPEAKER_02 5:51

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_00 5:53

Yeah. And I and I think that that's the way that it needed to happen. I think that God needed to kind of get a hold of me. And he needed to say to me essentially, like, this is me working in your life, and I want you to tell other people about it.

SPEAKER_01 6:07

Yeah. That's really cool that you kind of saw that shift throughout writing that book. And I'm sure that was in a in a sense, even writing it and then seeing that growth and that shift kind of therapeutic for you as well.

SPEAKER_00 6:20

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:21

Yeah. So I know on the trailer of your podcast, you have you mentioned kind of three different ways that the podcast will look.

Book Shift From Me To God

SPEAKER_01 6:30

Can you explain that a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 6:32

Yeah. So essentially it'll be like personal reflection from me about my whole testimony. Because my testimony doesn't start when my accident happened. It's further be before that. So I share all of that up to my accident, share my accident, and then what it was like living at the very beginning of my accident, the middle of my accident, and then now and kind of what my recovery process has been, where I've been and where I'm at. And the cool thing is that through that suffering, it it provided God provided a lot of refinement in me. God broke my pride. Oh my goodness. Like I like to think about you know the whole thing of like humble pie.

SPEAKER_02 7:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:12

Like I often refer to it as God force fed me humble pie, but it wasn't just one piece, it was like eight pies. It was eight. Like wow, if you've eaten so much food and you're like, I can't move, and God's like, no, here's another piece of humble pie. You need this. That's what it felt like. Because I mean, I'll just share this little thing. Because uh at one point I wasn't walking and I was in an e-scooter for a really long time, and I despised people that opened the door for me because I was like, I can do this myself, I don't need your help. It was my pride talking.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

Wow, that's tough. I think pride is hard to break, man. Yes, it is. So you mentioned that in your book, you kind of talk a little bit about your testimony before your accident and then thereafter. Are you comfortable sharing a little bit of that now?

SPEAKER_00 8:23

Yeah, I can. The the one thing though that I didn't mention, I think just with the previous question we talked about, because that was just like my personal reflection. The second part of that podcast stuff will be me and my wife talking about like how the effect of my accident or how my accident affected our marriage. Because I think it was like a year and a half. We were married for a year and a half, and then the accident happened somewhere around that ballpark.

SPEAKER_01 8:48

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

Yeah. So it was it was really early on into our marriage. So we had to have a lot, or

Three Podcast Formats

SPEAKER_00 8:56

we had to have a lot of really hard conversations up front. And it was really difficult because you know, going from being really fit to then not, and then feeling emasculated by it all because of society and how they place value on you is just very different. Um so we talk about that a lot because my wife and I are really passionate about marriages that we really want to see other people's marriages succeed, right? And if there's any way that we can share some of the trials that we had, some of the difficult conversations that we had that can help somebody else, it'll be worth it.

SPEAKER_03 9:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:29

And then we also have been helping, like through our own church, we have helped with premarital counseling classes. Like we don't like do the class, but we're some coaches or leaders in that. And we also walk through a bunch of different like the curriculum with a bunch of couples where we do one on one. So yeah. Then the final format of the podcast will be to interview guests and then I'll like talk with them about their trials and then what God taught them through it, and then how can they also encourage other people that are going through the same thing or through similar things?

SPEAKER_01 10:03

Yeah. I am excited to hear, particularly that second kind of format of your podcast with marriage, because I think maybe there is more attention given to older couples. I'm not sure. I'm not older. So if you're listening and you're older and you know how the church treats older couples in chronic illness, please feel free to comment and let us know how that works. Is there a lot of resources? Is there not? But I feel like it's probably more common because you know, typically you get chronic illnesses when you are older and then you get terminal illnesses when you are older. But it's a whole different ballpark when you're a year and a half into your marriage, you get into an accident, and then you have to deal with a chronic illness. And so in your marriage, and so I'm really looking forward to hearing that as I mean, my husband, they're newlyweds, and I'm chronically ill. He's the caretaker. And so, you know, I'd have right now, it's like I don't know where to turn for resources for that. We're in our 20s, right? So I'm really looking forward to hearing some stories, and I think that'll be a great resource for many of us.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

I appreciate that encouragement.

SPEAKER_01 11:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

And I agree, because there's definitely that was one thing too that I remember like even thinking about is it's like I because I think at the time I was 24 or no, yeah, 24 when it happened. And I was like, I am way too young to have be like chronically ill like this, right? Or like bedridden or couch ridden and not being able to walk. And it was just hard. Yeah, you know, trying to navigate that and figuring out how to take care of one another was difficult.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:38

And speaking into that, I think would be really beneficial, or at least I hope is beneficial to other people.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

Yeah, I'm sure it will be. Looking forward to that. So tell us a little bit about your story before the accident, as you know, just a little bit about what is what was your faith like before that?

SPEAKER_00 11:55

Yeah, so my faith, I was born and raised in the church. So the the way that I like to describe it was that I was born and raised like in Manhattan, Kansas, and in Kansas City. So we moved to Kansas City when I was around five years old. And my parents were heavily involved in the church

Faith Roots And Apologetics

SPEAKER_00 12:11

and did a lot of serving, and my mom did a bunch of stuff with kids' choir. So then as the son of my mother, I was brought to everything. So I was there all the time, right? And so then by nature, I got involved in the church too. So I I will say that I ended up, I'd say, getting involved in some of the how do I word it in like a healthy way here, like the traditions of Christianity rather than actually understanding the gospel of what Christianity teaches, right? Where like a lot of us have like heard the sinner's prayer, and I thought that that's what saved me, not actually placing my faith in Jesus. And that's a that's a point of contention among some believers, and like that's okay. Like the Bible says, like, if you will confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you'll be saved, right? I like to fall back on what scripture says rather than my own opinions, right? I've been that way about everything my whole life. So I know sometime in middle school I had placed my faith in Jesus. I just wish that I would remember when exactly, or like had a date. Because I know a lot of people have that and I don't, which I'm I'm sad about, but I'm also like, I know that there was a point in time there, I think it was probably because my parents sent me to a Christian school. And at that Christian school, we took a worldview class and we took Christianity and stacked it up against all the other world religions, and everything kept falling short. And I was like, okay, that's really cool. And I think that that was kind of like the thing because I then it got me really heavily involved in apologetics, and then yeah, I started arguing my faith with my friends and stuff, and actually standing up for God and for Jesus. And I even remember in high school, I mean, I would debate my friends who are atheists, and I lost some friends, but then one of my best friends in high school was an atheist. And like he and I would hang out and we were real with each other. And I think that that's what was the best part about our relationship and like our friendship there was because I could be honest about my beliefs and he could too. And we weren't trying to change each other. And I think like today's society, we're always trying to change people, or if you don't agree with me, then you're wrong. And it's like, I mean, my whole perspective is it's like as long as you're not trying to change the other person, you can have a conversation about it. You don't have to be mad at the other person, right? But unfortunately, sometimes uh there's people that we talk with and they don't act that way, and it's it's unfortunate. But then as the transition out of high school and the college, like my faith definitely grew and became more personal. And I went to college and Ozark Christian college and got a degree in Christian ministry with an emphasis in worship, and that was a wonderful learning experience of understanding a lot more of like the like historical background of manuscripts and understanding that the Bible is true, it is the word of God, and actually seeing the physical evidence and understanding it and studying it to me was just like, oh my goodness, like this is a little bit more easy to believe in because of those things.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

That's really cool. So apologetics really helped you.

SPEAKER_03 15:15

Yes, definitely. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:16

All right. So then at 24-ish, something happened. So can you tell us first what is the name of your diagnosis and then what led up to that diagnosis?

SPEAKER_00 15:31

Sure. So the acronym, I'll give you the acronym and I'll tell you what it means, is CRPS. So it stands for Complex Regional Pain Syndrome. And from my understanding, after you know, because I had to start doing research on it once they told me. They didn't tell me what it meant, they just told me this is what I have. And I was like, cool, what is that? You

CRPS Explained With Real Pain

SPEAKER_00 15:51

know, so I had to go and do research and then started studying it from like CDC, the NIH, a bunch of medical journals and articles. And from from what I understand, is that it is a malfunction with the nervous system. Is that whether it's my brain saying that my foot hurts or my foot's telling my brain that it hurts, somewhere there is a miscommunication, and my fight or flight is basically turned on at all times.

SPEAKER_02 16:19

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 16:20

So my body thinks that it is in danger, it is in pain. One of the crazy symptoms I have is if I get jump scared, I get that hit of adrenaline and I cannot come down for it for a good couple hours.

SPEAKER_03 16:31

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_00 16:32

Yeah, it's super weird. But that and like just the the the constant pain that I deal with is kind of I'd say the way that I would describe it. And like the way that I do feel pain is it's like getting electrocuted, stabbed, and lit on fire all at the same time. So it's not it's not pleasant to say the least.

SPEAKER_02 16:51

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 16:52

Yeah. But then I had to really dive a lot into like self-education because there's a lot of doctors even that have very strong opinions about the diagnosis because there's not a lot of study that was done on it and has been done on it. So it's still there's a lot of development going on in it too.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Wow. So I know that you mentioned with this CRP, wait, right, CRPS? You mentioned with CRPS in our talk before that it's quite painful. Can you tell us a little bit more about the the pain of it?

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Absolutely. So the uh there's a pain scale that you can go and Google called, I believe it's the McGill Pain Index. And you can see like on like charts from like zero all the way up to 50 that there are different uh levels for things, like a headache is like 10. I'm trying to even remember because I don't have it in front of me. So don't quote me on this. But then it'll go up to like prepared childbirth at like 32, unprepared childbirth at a 38, and then it goes to, I think at 42, there's a neuralgia, which is like a nerve pain syndrome, and then at 44 through 46 is CRPS, and then there's nothing higher than that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:14

Oh my gosh, that's insane. That's painful, I'm sure. Yeah. So you are able to look back and see what caused this, right?

SPEAKER_00 18:28

Oh, yeah. So my accident, I was throwing away a cultured marble countertop with a coworker, and we were throwing it into a dumpster, and then as we had rotated it on the dumpster so that it would fall in, it snapped, and then that portion landed onto my left foot. And I did the guy thing, right? You know, rub some dirt in it, limp it off, pretend everything's

Crush Injury That Started It

SPEAKER_00 18:51

fine, suck it up, move on with my life, right? So I did that. I mean, like when it happened, it hurt. Like, I'm not gonna lie. And I probably said words that I shouldn't have said when it happened. But I remember like picking up the pieces of the countertop that had broken and then throwing them into the dumpster, hobbling back into the truck, and then going on to our last job site. And like, praise God that our last job site was just fixing a sink at some other house. Right. It was very, very easy. Got home, took off my shoe and my sock, iced it, elevated it, took ibuprofen, rested, and went to bed. Didn't really think anything of it. And then I woke up and I put my feet down on the carpet in our apartment and felt the worst pain I've ever felt in my life.

SPEAKER_02 19:33

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

And I was like, what is this? Like, I have no idea what's wrong. Like I have broken bones in my feet, and I know what that feels like. This is a whole new category of pain.

SPEAKER_02 19:45

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 19:46

And because I'm just a very I say that I'm a genuine person, and sometimes people say it and they're not, but I really like having face-to-face conversations with people, especially over matters that are important or serious. So I hobbled into work, limping, every step was horrendously painful. And I went to my boss and I told them what happened, and they were like, hey, go to urgent care. And then that was kind of how the the process of finding out what was wrong began. And then I, I think about a couple of months later, was diagnosed with CRPS by a foot surgeon after I was doing uh physical therapy. And I remember he told me what I had, and then he was white in the face. He stood up and then walked out. Like he he said, This is what you have, I'm referring you to pain management, and then he left. And I was like, Well, what was this mean? I don't know what this means. Like, can you tell me? But the there it was, it was almost like looking at a ghost. And I think it was because he knew how bad the diagnosis was and didn't have the heart to tell me at the time. So I went into a lot of like different medications, and then they opened up like that medicine cabinet on me. I think at one point I was taking 24 or 25 medications a day.

SPEAKER_03 21:04

Jeez.

SPEAKER_00 21:05

As like you know, like 25-year-old, 26-year-old, and I was like, I feel like you know, I woke up in a 70-year-old person's body, but I'm not 70. Yeah, and it was just it was rough.

SPEAKER_01 21:18

Well, yeah, it's life-changing in the matter of what a day, a moment, really.

SPEAKER_00 21:24

It was wild.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

Yeah, wow, that's crazy. So they put you on a ton of medication. And are you still on that medication?

SPEAKER_00 21:33

Oh no, yeah, no, I'm not.

SPEAKER_01 21:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

So, and like my experience with like the medical industry is I'm not a big fan, right? Like, I felt like the medical industry was just trying to treat my symptoms and not fix me.

SPEAKER_03 21:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

And I wanted to be fixed and I wanted to walk again, and that was my end goal. And I kept telling my doctors that it wasn't like it was like they weren't listening, right?

unknown 21:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Because they they wanted to treat it a specific way, and then I would research that treatment. And I was like, hey, this is showing this. So I I became a very large advocate for myself

Pushing Back On Medication Overload

SPEAKER_00 22:07

because I wanted to walk again, and I was refusing to take the answer that they were like, You won't walk again. I'm like, watch me. Like I had that level of determination. So you know, I it took me a really long time to find the answer, right? But I I was talking to my doctors and I was like, look, I'm on all these medications and I'm having a bunch of side effects, and then I'm taking more medication to then treat those side effects, and I am sick of it, and I just want to stop. Is there any way that I can treat this with like changing diet or food or lifestyle or anything? And they're like, Well, we can try it and see what happens. So my doctor recommended the Mediterranean diet, and I did that, and it helped a lot, and I was able to get off of a good amount of medication. And then I altered the Mediterranean diet to be basically like a holistic diet, where I started eating foods that were very like dense in calorie and nutrition that were whole food and organic. Then I moved away from a lot of the heavily processed foods. And I I mean, every once in a while, sure, I'll go out and eat fast food or something, but I'm

Mediterranean Diet And Holistic Changes

SPEAKER_00 23:16

still really careful with what I eat and what I put into my body.

SPEAKER_03 23:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:20

Um, and that's just because it helped a lot. And then I started doing some research into some other things. And then after, you know, changing a couple other doctors from the CRPS community, I had heard about something called LDN or low dose naltrexome. And that medication, so from the point when I had my accident up until I started taking that medication, I mean, I was sleeping maybe four hours a night. And it was never altogether. It was like choppy. 30 minutes here, 40 minutes there, maybe an hour there. And it was just, I was miserable, right?

SPEAKER_01 23:54

And that was because of the pain or because of the medication?

SPEAKER_00 23:56

It was the pain.

SPEAKER_01 23:58

Oh man.

SPEAKER_00 23:59

And like they they were like, hey, let's give you codeine or fentanyl. And then I was just like, no, I have an addictive personality. I don't, I don't want anything to do with those things. And so when I got into this other doctor, I talked to with him about LDN. He was like, eh, I'm not gonna look into that. And I was like, would you just do it for me? Look into it because I would like to try it.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

What is LDN?

SPEAKER_00 24:21

Low dose naltrexone.

SPEAKER_01 24:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 24:24

And then I had, you know, kind of reminded him of it again. I was like, hey, you know, there's a lot of people in this community that I'm a part of that say that it's really helpful. So we tried it, and really good and then a little bit of bad. So I'll kind of speak into that with what happened there. My I think starting dose was like two milligrams or something, like the low dose. And like it's a it's a very low compounded version of the medication because usually it's like 250 or something like that. I don't know what it actually is, usually, so don't quote me on that. But I started low and then we titrated up for a I want to say like 0.5 milligrams every few weeks. There was to see how it would work and help. And I think it was somewhere around four milligrams. I started dreaming again, which was amazing because before then I hadn't been able to get into that state of sleep. So my sleep wasn't very restful at all. And then I was like, man, my you know, the amount that I was sleeping didn't increase, but my quality went through the roof. And we went up to 4.5 milligrams, and that's where it got bad. Oh, because my dreams became very hyper-realistic, and I could feel pain in my dreams. Oh man. And I kept reliving my accident in my dreams. And it was horrible. And that was like, I was like, hey, we need to we need to move down, we need to not not be at 4.5. So we went down to four and we stayed there for a while. And that medication was great. I don't take it anymore. Would I take it again? Absolutely, just because it was so helpful. But the thing that's wild is I can still dream now, which I'm like, hey, maybe it did something that unlocked something that was stuck. I don't know how it works. I'm not the doctor, right? I just heard of it helping and it helped me. And I like talking about it because of my experience with it. Then they also, and this is the the breakthrough that like I so desperately needed was I was a candidate

Low Dose Naltrexone Pros And Cons

SPEAKER_00 26:26

for a medical device called an H-wave, right? If you've ever used a tens unit, you'll understand what that is, or I guess I can I'll explain it. But a tens unit, the waveform is either all the way on or all the way off, right? So it'll like go up, be all the way on at like 100%, then come down and be all the way off at 0%. Well, the way that an H-wave unit works is it goes up to 100% peaks and then comes down at an arc and then goes to zero. And the way that it works is there's like a low frequency and a high frequency. Well, the low frequency will essentially like take your muscles and then pulsate them.

SPEAKER_01 27:00

Is this like something you connect to you?

SPEAKER_00 27:02

Yes, yeah. Okay. So there's like electrode pads that I then attach to my foot at different places.

SPEAKER_01 27:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 27:08

And so it'll it'll pulsate the muscles, which then increases blood flow, reduces atrophy, and promotes healing, right? Then the high version of that is the pain version, right? Where it helps reduce your pain. And the first time that I tried it, I put it on. They kind of taught me how to use it where you you turn it up so that you can kind of feel the buzzing, or like it feels like a really, really mild, like electrical shock, like static electricity almost, right?

SPEAKER_03 27:36

Right.

SPEAKER_00 27:36

Not as severe, because sometimes those can be bad, right? I've been shocked a couple times like that, and that doesn't feel good. But the this is significantly more mild than like the bad ones of those. So you turn it up until you can barely feel it, and then you wait until you can't feel it, and then you turn it up until you just feel it, and then you wait until you can't feel it, and you do that in a repeating sense until you've been doing that for about 45 minutes or an hour.

SPEAKER_03 28:01

I usually always do it an hour, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:03

And when I do it, I usually have my foot above my heart because that's just what they told me to do, and it reduced my pain by 50%.

SPEAKER_01 28:11

Oh my word.

SPEAKER_00 28:12

And to me, that was the best thing that I've ever done. Like I've done nerve blocks and stuff like that that took my pain away completely. But the problem was that when the nerve block wore off, my pain was through the roof because I couldn't feel what I was doing was painful, right? And then when my body was like, hey, you did a lot of stuff that you you like my body's freaking out about. It's like, dude, now you're paying for it.

SPEAKER_01 28:35

Yeah, it was just it's like being on Day Quill when you have the flu, right? For like a few hours, you're fine, and then all of a sudden you realize, oh, my body's actually been in pain this whole time and just couldn't feel it. Except for your pain scale is 46 or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 28:50

Right, right, yeah. So yeah, it's it's kind of kind of crazy.

SPEAKER_02 28:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:55

Yeah. The the one thing that I would even say and attest to that too, is it's like I didn't realize that God, like looking, you said looking back on it now, like you know, that event was what caused it. It was the crush injury that caused it. But looking back to throughout my life, there was a point where I had experiences that God was using to prepare me for what I deal

H-Wave Breakthrough For Daily Pain

SPEAKER_00 29:16

with now. And when I was younger, I would run and break the bones in my feet. Right. I have uh like a I think it's like a physical disorder where it's called metatarsis adductus. At least that's what they assume. No, that's yeah, that's what they told me I had. And it essentially like the bones in your feet, they're either like they're they're supposed to grow straight. Mine kind of grow in like crescent moons, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 29:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 29:41

So when I run, it puts pressure on specific parts of my joints and then they break. So as a kid, I would do that because I'd play sports, I'd play basketball, and you know, I'd roll an ankle, break a bone. I'd still play on it, I'd still walk on it. And it would hurt, but it was like a dull pain, you know, like it wasn't anything. Or I was like, Oh my goodness, my foot's broken, right? I was like, it just it's it's annoying.

SPEAKER_02 30:06

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

And I went, you know, I kept complaining about one this one particular time to my mom, and I was like, this really hurts, and it's just annoying. Can we go like get it looked at? And she's like, sure, I'll I'll take you to the doctor. I go to the doctor, and the doctor's like, hey, if you broke your foot, you'd know it. You wouldn't be able to use it. And I was like, okay. And he's like, well, let's go get an x-ray, walk down the hall, get the x-ray, walk back, sit back on the exam table. Doctor comes back and pulls my mom into the hallway, and I thought I was in trouble. And I was so worried sitting in that room, just quiet. And I didn't know this at the time, but the doctor apologized to my mom. And he was like, Hey, your son has a broken foot, and we need to put him in a cast. And I'm really sorry for what I said before. He's like, Your son has uh a high pain tolerance that I haven't seen in a kid in probably forever, or something like that, right? So he walked back in and then apologized to me, explained that my foot is broken, that I'm getting a cast, and then they put a cast on me, and then that's kind of the rest of it. And it was just so I didn't realize that you know I had this high pain tolerance, and then coming into then dealing with the most painful chronic pain diagnosis, there is is like, okay, God gave me that to then deal with this too. So it's like, yes, I deal with a lot of pain, but of the same perspective, it's probably a bit different just because of my tolerance levels with it.

SPEAKER_01 31:27

Right. Yeah, thank God for that. I love the positive spin on that. Yeah, right.

unknown 31:34

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 31:35

That's awesome. Also cool that that doctor actually apologized. Like I feel like so rare. Yeah, absolutely. So, do you find how do you find that your chronic condition affects you on the day-to-day now?

SPEAKER_00 31:54

So, like the the way that it affects me today still, I mean, it's it's it's been this way since the first, I guess, like symptoms started arrive like appearing in my life. So I'm I'm still unable to wait bare on my left foot. Like I can't walk without assistive devices. Or I have like an exoskeleton leg, and I can talk about that later. My leg will randomly sweat. It changes colors to like a dark red or dark scarlet red color. It's super weird. It's very cold to the touch. So like if you touch it, it's I I I describe it as like icy cold. It's not that cold, but it's definitely way colder than the other leg.

SPEAKER_02 32:36

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 32:37

Through some of the testing, we found out that there's decreased blood flow just because of the diagnosis. And usually I wear a wool sock on my left foot year round because if it gets cold, it hurts more. So I try to keep it warm because with cold increasing the pain, I don't want it to then get worse, right? I don't want my pain to be a higher level than what I'm already at during that day. So and then that comes with, you know, I'd say like some secondary effects because of the pain that's there that lasts. You know, my sleep doesn't really sleep, I guess is the way to phrase it. I I do sleep, but it's not, you know, by choice, I guess if you if that makes sense. Like I'll get so tired that I'll end up then falling asleep. But it's like if I go try to go to sleep, it's really hard to just fall asleep.

SPEAKER_01 33:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:27

So you know, I I I it's definitely gotten, I'd say, a little bit better. Like I get four to six hours now, uh more on the lower end than the higher end every 24 hours. So it's definitely low. Where before I usually got about eight, which is just crazy to think about.

SPEAKER_03 33:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:45

And then that brings in like different levels of exhaustion and brain fog, short-term memory issues. So there's a lot of that.

SPEAKER_01 33:52

Yeah, sleep is important. It affects our brains a lot. Wow. Yes. So you're still finding a lot of pain, super interesting symptoms like color changing, sweating, constant pain, obviously, and then sleep issues. So you have like, do you still have a roller? Like you said, like a scooter or something.

SPEAKER_00 34:14

Yeah, I still have my knee scooter. Essentially, it's like um a super weird thing. So, what I use right now, it's like an a hybrid prosthetic orthotic leg. There's only two of them in the United States. One is called the Exosim, which is a really cool company. Both of these

Exoskeleton Brace And Walking Tools

SPEAKER_00 34:31

are also based out of Washington State. And then the one that I have is it's called like a reactive brace, with it's they call it a PDE element. I don't really know what it stands for. Essentially, it's all like a carbon fiber shell that goes around my left leg from my knee all the way down past my toes. There's a foot plate of rigid carbon fiber. There's a strut along the back of my leg of carbon fiber, and then the shin, like the whole shin is gold and like a cuff that then is like the prosthetic element that then ratchets down. And what it does is it shifts the weight bearing from the ball of my foot to my shin. So I'm able to actually walk with it, which is wild.

SPEAKER_01 35:12

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_00 35:14

It's really cool.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

Wow. How did you end up getting connected to that through that particular business?

SPEAKER_00 35:19

No, so I I got connected to that because I got accepted into the exosim program and insurance was like, we're not gonna pay for that, it's too expensive. Then they found this other device and they got me this one. Well, I look at that as a good thing just because people that have the exosim, what I've seen is that they lose a lot of their muscle mass in their leg. And I don't know if it's because of the H-wave or it's because of the the exoskeleton that I have. But I've I've lost, I think, like the whole interior calf muscle, but the like the exterior side of it is still there. Wow. But it's it's definitely not just bone for me, which is good. And I think that it I think that the uh the H-wave has helped with that.

SPEAKER_01 36:00

So wow. So something you kind of like connect to your foot or leg, and then you can walk with it.

SPEAKER_00 36:07

Yeah, it's like a shell that goes around it.

SPEAKER_01 36:09

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 36:10

That's really cool.

SPEAKER_01 36:11

Yeah, yeah, that's so cool that you have like a unique tool like that to where you can you can walk again. Sure, that was phenomenal.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

Yes, yeah. Like uh one of the other cool things. Well, I wouldn't say cool things, one of the other things that I do use is a cane. I also have like a walking stick. Walking stick is when I throw my back out because I overcompensate. So I I tend to do that, you know, it'll happen randomly. I can't reproduce it, it's frustrating. It's been an on and off, ongoing thing for many years.

SPEAKER_03 36:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:42

Then I use a cane and I use like this tip on the end of it called a flex tip. You can find it on Amazon. It's like 20 bucks, 25 bucks. It may have gone up more than that since I bought the last one. But it is amazing. It's like a hurricane. Uh I feel so old talking about these things, but like because this is like an old person conversation, but it's fine. Like it's kind of like a hurricane, but way better. It's it's a much wider base, but it has a string, a spring on it, so you can actually put your weight bearing through it and lean into it, which is nice. And then it has it's like a a triangle prong, like base. So when it falls over, you can then step on it and then stand itself back up, which is super nice. So then you don't have to bend over to pick it up, which is great.

SPEAKER_01 37:26

Oh, interesting.

SPEAKER_00 37:28

Yeah, it's fantastic. So I use that. Wow, I'll use it for bad pain days, or if like I bump my foot by accident and my pain's elevated, or somebody steps on my foot and my pain's through the roof. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:39

Yeah.

unknown 37:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:40

And I I try to reserve that for when I need it now, but this sometimes I still use it just because I need it. Because I don't want to rely on it. Because I got in a lot of trouble with relying on that instead of trusting the device that's on my leg and and having to like learn to walk again with that was different because the way that I have to do that is I have to be relaxed from the knee down on my left leg, which sounds super weird. That's just the way like I have to trust the device to actually support myself. And it took a long time to learn how to trust it.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

Like whenever you have to walk again.

SPEAKER_00 38:15

Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 38:16

Oh. Okay. So that's quite the unique journey that you're experiencing. And yeah, especially for being younger. So I know that you had mentioned a lot of your beginning journey with this, um, at least reflected in your book. There was a lot of focus on you and what you were going through, which by the way, I think is appropriate, you know, to for the time being, right? And it's cool to hear that gradually you saw a shift of the focus then becoming on God. And I think that kind of comes with proper grief, you know, and I'm dumb. And so I'd love to hear more about that shift from that focus and you seeing God working in it.

SPEAKER_00 39:04

Yeah, absolutely. I'd say that the like the shift kind of happened more of

From Why To Gratitude

SPEAKER_00 39:12

when I was kind of in those like really like deep, dark places, you know, where I would just kind of like I'd be sitting in my apartment or in my house, and I would just kind of be like, I'd say wallowing in self-pity a bit, but then also worshiping God by like singing or playing my guitar. And it would turn into those moments where I lost the words and I'm just you know, sobbing and ended up just being in silence and then just kind of not necessarily pleading with God, but just being in that moment where it's like, I have no words, and I'm just groaning. And I'm like, I am hurting and I am in pain, and I'm like, God, I just want you to take it from me. And it's like I bargained, I asked God to heal me, I did all the things, and I I felt like for a long time I never got an answer, right? Yeah, and you know, I'm like, God, if you heal me, I would shout this from the rooftops. I would tell everybody about what you did. Right. And, you know, instead I just hid behind my smile because I can do that because of my pain tolerance, right? It's like I don't want people to know, I don't want people to look at me differently, I don't want people to think that, oh, there's the guy that deals with chronic pain and always talks about it, you know. So in those moments, it was just I I just had this heavily, like heavy reliance on God where I'm just I I have nothing else. I am at the bottom of this valley, I am in the middle of this fire. And even in that, God was still right next to me. And he's there walking with me through it. And it's like I think the the issue earlier on was I was so polarized by my pain that I didn't see God there next to me, or I didn't want to see God next to me. But whenever I look back, I'm like, yeah, he was there the whole time. I just failed to look for him. And I think that that can happen because our perspective is is on the wrong thing, right? Like I kept asking God why, and that question changed into instead of asking God why, God, how can I glorify you in the middle of this?

SPEAKER_02 41:28

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 41:29

And that was like a a huge change in my perspective. So my my perspective started to essentially stop being about me and more about him, right? And I stopped focusing the things of this world and focused on things of eternity and looking forward to what it's going to be like in eternity. And that hope, that yeah, that gave me a lot of hope and a lot of gratitude for God. And it it there was also like a conversation. I was I was still in my knee scooter at the time. I went to a coffee shop with my wife, and this guy asked me how I was. I'm like, I'm fine, you know, leave me alone, whatever. And he looked at me and was just like, because I was like, you know, the common courtesy, someone asks you how you are, how are you? You know. He's like, God woke me up this morning, I'm doing really well. And then he just walked on by and had this joy about him. And I was like, Why can't I say the same thing? And the next day I did.

SPEAKER_02 42:27

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

And then the day after I did, and then the day after, and it just it it gave me this sense of gratitude that God woke me up, has trusted me and blessed me with another day that I am able to praise him, tell other people about him, glorify him for the things that he's done in my life. And I feel like that gratitude was kind of what really started helping me with changing my perspective on my situation, right? Because I'm like, okay, how can I glorify God in this instead? And that I can tell other people about the things that he's done in spite of all of the bad that's happened in my life, and then trusting that God will use it for good and stepping out in faith and actually talking about it, even though it can be painful to talk about, or having conversations with people and letting them share the things that they've gone through too. I mean, when I've opened up to people, then they open up to me, and it's it's absolutely wild to see.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

Yeah. Do you think that that interaction with that stranger was the turning point of your perspective?

SPEAKER_00 43:35

I think that it was definitely part of the tipping point. I don't know if it was that interaction entirely. I definitely think that it was kind of a combination of me being at my lowest and me, I'd say like wallowing and God, you know, being like, hey, look, I'm still here. And then that happening. I think there was a couple other things that had happened too off the top of my head, I can't remember, but I think moving more into having like a gratifying or like having gratitude and having that attitude toward God instead of being upset or mad at him, you know, I think really. Helped me change my perspective on the matter. Yeah. And once that happened, I mean it it it started, you know, I'd say spreading like a wildfire in my life. Where then, like in if I ever prayed in front of people, that would be how I started my prayer was God, thank you for waking everybody up today, or like each and every one of us up today. Because I know that, you know, I could go to sleep and die and go to heaven and not be here tomorrow. And I want to thank God that He gave me the day.

unknown 44:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:44

You know? And then it that gratitude kind of turned into more of like, I mean, I could be very nitpicky with it or uh legalistic with it, where I look at it too now where God gives me my next breath, right? And how am I going to use that to glorify him?

unknown 45:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:03

You know, because I could use it to complain, right? I could use it to be angry with God or I could use it to glorify him and tell people of his goodness, even in my life, and I deal with pretty horrible pain, you know, and and for me to come and say God is still good regardless of my pain, and I wouldn't be here without him. And not saying that my experience with God will be the same experience with you, but God doesn't withhold his blessings from us. And oftentimes we think, you know, oh, God can't use me because of you know this or that. And it's like God wants to bless us. We're his children, we are his creation, we are infinitely valuable in his eyes. And I want to tell people that because I needed to be told that when I was in those dark places and didn't have anybody to tell me.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

Yeah. Thanks for being willing to tell people that, even when you didn't have that. I'm curious because you obviously still experience pain every day, and you have three boys, and I'm sure there are instances like you mentioned where you hit your foot or you get stepped on.

SPEAKER_03 46:12

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:13

I would like to hear as much as you're comfortable sharing. Oh, yeah, absolutely. In those moments of, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but probably pretty excruciating pain. How

Parenting Through Sudden Pain Spikes

SPEAKER_01 46:26

do you do you manage? And if not, that's okay, but how do you manage kind of not, you know, kind of emotionally exploding in those moments? Or have you done that and then had to reconcile those moments?

SPEAKER_00 46:40

Definitely have exploded, right?

unknown 46:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:42

Being 100% transparent and honest, and I've had to ask for forgiveness, right?

SPEAKER_03 46:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:47

And I had to, I have to explain those things to my kids and say, like, look, you know, dad has this, and and all of my kids have known about this since they were born, right? Essentially, like when they had the understanding of what like why does dad have to attach a leg to himself? Why does he walk with a cane? And we've we've discussed that at great lengths with them. And in those moments where, let's say, you know, my son steps on my foot, I can't speak. I can't move, I can't really muster anything. And it's almost like the way that my body reacts is it's just like a tensing of all of my muscles. And I just am in that, and I'm kind of stuck in that for a while until the pain comes down where I can then try to speak. And then I have to be really, really slow with my communication because otherwise I will lash out. And that's something that I do very hard to try not to do.

unknown 47:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:39

And the way that I deal with that is I just surrender it to God, right? There's there's no like magic code or pill or anything to that. It's like I am in some of the worst pain of my life right now, and I have a choice on how I can act. And I can either act in accordance with what God teaches me, or I can react how the world would say that would be okay. You know, it would be justifiable for me to scream because I'm in pain.

unknown 48:06

Right.

SPEAKER_00 48:07

But then it's also like I have to think to myself, am I setting a good example for my children if I do that? It's like it once they know, you know, dad deals with this horrible pain and he just stepped on his bad foot. But he was able to collect himself in that moment. He was able to then teach me in that moment to be more careful with my body.

unknown 48:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:24

And that's that's one of the things that I really try to teach my boys. Because I'm large, you know, they're large, I'm very tall. My eight-year-old's really tall too. And I have to tell him constantly, I'm like, you are a big child. And because you are larger, you are stronger than other kids your size. You need to be careful of how you move because you could hurt somebody unintentionally. And it's like, God gave you this body for a very good reason. I don't know how he is going to use it. But you need to be careful with the body that he gave you so that you don't accidentally hurt somebody with it. And those kinds of conversations, I'd say that they're they're sometimes more difficult than others, depending on, you know, the situation, right? But I I look at it in those kinds of things. Or one of the things that I I do too is I also, because of my past with construction, I still have a lot of head knowledge about what to do and how to do it. So I love helping people with like their house projects, right? I can't do them nearly to the same level that I was able to before, right? Like an example was I can I could have you know flipped a bathroom in about a day back before by myself. And now it would take me, you know, two, three, four weeks by myself.

unknown 49:40

Right.

SPEAKER_00 49:40

If I have help, it goes significantly faster because then I'm able to rely on somebody that's able to then help me a lot more in the process because like I have the know-how, but I don't have the physicality to do it anymore. And in doing those things, I exert myself even sometimes to the point where I'm way past my limit because I love other people and I want to bless other people. Like God's blessed me immensely. I am incredibly rich, not in money, in everything else. I am rich in my faith with God. I am rich in my family. I have three boys who are healthy. I have a wonderful wife who loves me and supports me, and that's enough. And being content in those things, I think has has taught me a lot of like what really matters in life, right? And I think that the things that matter in life are worth fighting for. So I want to help people because I'm passionate about that, and I don't want people to have to pay tons of money to fix things.

SPEAKER_03 50:42

Right.

SPEAKER_00 50:43

It's like, so if I can help them out and be like, yeah, dude, just pay me the cost of the materials. You know, it might take me a few hours to do something that probably should take, you know, a professional like 30 minutes, but it's significantly cheaper. So, you know. But then after I do that, it's I usually have like a two to three day span where then my pain tolerance goes through the roof and then I'm out for about a day or sometimes two. It just depends on the situation.

SPEAKER_01 51:10

Well, that's cool that you try to bless people within your means and within your gifts still. That's really cool. I reeling back a little, I have two questions. One, what do those conversations with your kids or your wife look like in the circumstances where you know maybe like you do explode because of the pain? What do those conversations of reconciliation look like? And then the second was you mentioned that you in those moments where you're able to compose yourself and you said that you surrender that to God. What does that look like to surrender to God?

SPEAKER_00 51:46

Yeah, yeah. So I would say with the first question, and I might have to have you repeat the second one, but with the first question, like when I do explode, I own it, right? I don't want to beat around the bush. I want to be direct and be honest and say, look, I did wrong and I am sorry for what I did. Will you forgive me? And in explaining that to them, I mean it sets an example of like being able to own up to my own failures and show humble humble pie. Yep, yeah, and then show them, you know, like I would say like the the proper way to deal with it when I didn't deal with it properly, right? And then just you know, explain to them because they're I mean, I'm trying to think of the last time it's been a while, but I know that there've been a good amount of times that that's happened where like I I would say, like, for example, my middle child, you know, bumped my bad foot, and then I'm like, don't do that, but you know, I had dad voiced it or semi-yelled at him, and I'm like, Dad is sorry that I yelled at you. When you hit my foot, it hurt really bad. And we've talked about how you have to be careful around my bad foot. And maybe it's partially my fault because my foot was in an area where I know you were going to be moving and I didn't protect it. But at the same point, you also need to be careful and essentially gently remind them about that too, because it's it's kind of the same same thing with my older son because he's big. Yeah, you have to be careful with how you move yourself so you don't hurt somebody else. And what was the second question?

SPEAKER_01 53:24

Yeah, what does it mean to surrender in those moments?

SPEAKER_00 53:28

Oh, yeah. Full transparency here. In those moments, I want to scream, I want to lash out, and I choose not to. And it's hard because it's like I then choose to let it go and then realign myself with what I know God wants me to do, and then act in that way. And it is not easy, it's very difficult because it's like the way that I want to act, the way that I want to do, and instead I'm denying that and moving in the way that God wants me to react in that. Then, you know, I don't want to do the whole I I don't know if I would say like the cheesy thing of like, well, what would Jesus do? Right. It would be, you know, I would say it's like, how does Jesus want me to respond on this moment instead? And I need to then act that out and essentially like be that example for my family and my kids. And, you know, I fall short of that often. And I do, I'm trying to do better every single time. And I'd say working on that is more of like the like the sanctification process, right? Less of me, more of him.

SPEAKER_01 54:39

Yeah. Which I'm sure is harder in the moment for sure. Yeah. I think that's really important and good to hear your transparency with your kids. I love to hear that you're straightforward with them. You're, you know, and you inform them of what's going on. And I think that is probably, I don't know. I'm not a parent and I'm not a psychologist or your pastor or anything like that. But I would guess that that's probably the best choice is to just be in front with your kids and just honest about the circumstance. And also, yeah, I I think it's beautiful too that you were able to apologize in moments that you are imperfect. I think, like you said, honestly, anybody could understand if you're experiencing excruciating pain. I think anybody can understand, you know, the desire to lash out or lose your temper. Super understandable. But it's really cool to hear that when you do mess up, you are able to kind of confess your sins to your children, which is such a good example to them. And if anybody's listening and you have kids, I highly encourage that. I encourage that honest, transparent, forward, you know, communication and that humility

What Surrender Looks Like

SPEAKER_01 56:02

to be that example of yeah, just someone who's honest and can own up to your mistakes. So I think that's so beautiful and so cool. And I hope that you know, us who are listening can also gleam from that surrendering in moments of pain. And yeah, I think it's so tricky because there's like there's a there's a strange balance of accepting and experiencing pure emotion, right? Like God made us with feeling and emotion and a nervous system. And unfortunately, with yours, it's a little complex. Yeah. And so there's such a strange balance, but I think with the Holy Spirit and reading scripture, hopefully we can get more towards that balance of that accepting. Okay, in this moment, I am feeling excruciating pain. I am very angry, and I'm in fight or flight. I my adrenaline is through the roof. And then also, you know, accepting that just I think you don't have a choice but to feel it in your body.

SPEAKER_00 57:16

Right.

SPEAKER_01 57:17

But then also that almost like, yeah, I guess spiritual kind of out-of-body, not out of body per se, but you know what I mean. Like experience of there's more to this. You know, my kids are here, their future is here, how I respond in this moment is here, reflecting Christ is here. And so, yeah, what a what a cool, I think that alone is a huge testament of God working in you. And of course, it's not perfect, but I hope that someday, you know, your kids will look back. And even though they'll know that their dad wasn't perfect, you know, and there were moments and there were there were trials in you having this chronic condition, they can see God's grace working in you in those moments. So thanks for sharing that experience transparently. I think that's helpful for those of us who will be parents or are parents who are chronically ill. So thanks for that.

SPEAKER_00 58:15

Yeah. The I'd say like the one thing that I've I've learned, and I because I've been in counseling for, I say, probably three and a half years or so, is that kids really want to know why. And being able to explain that to them, I think has been very helpful too.

SPEAKER_01 58:29

Yeah. Explaining the why.

SPEAKER_00 58:32

Yeah, like why dad is in pain and explaining to them, you know, I have this condition and being honest with them. You know, kids want attention, they want honesty, but they also want to know why that's happening. Or like, hey, I can't play outside with you guys today. Well, why dad? Well, dad's in a lot of pain because I hit my foot yesterday, or dad's in a lot of pain because I helped a buddy out two days ago, and my pain is through the roof. It's can we go outside tomorrow? Will that work? Yeah, okay, cool. We'll do that together then. And being just honest and transparent with them and just having open communication, I think, is really healthy.

SPEAKER_01 59:08

Yeah.

unknown 59:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:09

That's awesome. Do

Identity In Christ And Porn Recovery

SPEAKER_01 59:11

you think that your relationship with God or your belief in God has changed much since the onset of symptoms?

SPEAKER_00 59:21

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 59:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 59:24

I would say, yeah, 100%. I mean, like being being born and raised in the church and you know, like learning about God and understanding the Bible, going to or like I say, debating atheists in high school and having friends who were atheists and going through Bible college, right, and getting a degree in that. I would say the accident brought me way deeper than all of that combined. And I think it was more because a lot of it was like head knowledge, right? Like I knew a lot of stuff about the Bible. I knew a lot about God, about Jesus, and how the Holy Spirit operates, right? But I didn't really, I would say, live it out to the full extent that I could have, right? I didn't have, I think it's like the saying of I have the heart or the head knowledge, but not the heart knowledge, right?

unknown 1:00:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:17

And it was that transition between head and heart knowledge where I started seeing a lot of large changes because my accident created this level of dependency on God every day, right? Where I had to go to Him when I'm in a lot of pain, or you know, when I'm trying to navigate this whole thing as you know, a 20-something year old and essentially being a shut-in for a while and not having friendships because they just won't understand.

unknown 1:00:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:47

And I didn't I didn't want to share because I didn't want to bring other people down with me. And man, I thought a lot, like I I had and struggled with low self-worth for a very long time. And that was something that I had to unlearn.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:04

Wow. How did you unlearn that?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:09

I unlearned that, let me see here, because I started like it's like going to counseling and studying scripture, right? And the I'd say like the pivotal moment was when I realized like the way that God saw me wasn't as somebody who was disabled, wasn't somebody who just has CRPS or chronic pain. Like God looks at me the way that he looks at his son and is proud of his son. And when he sees me, he sees the blood of Jesus, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:44

Oh, that's good.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:46

And yeah, and it's just that's the truth, right? Yeah. And and you know, I I often thought that the way that God looked at me was kind of like the way that I felt God looked at me when I would sin or when I would do wrong, and is that he was disappointed or mad at me. And it's not that, like the way that I describe it is it's like if you had a child addicted to drugs, you still love your child, but you want so much more for them to then just be addicted to drugs.

unknown 1:02:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:15

You want them to have a full life that is free from addiction.

unknown 1:02:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:19

And that's the way that I feel like God, you know, is looking at me. It's like, you know, hey, you are in the middle of this, you're dealing with this addiction to pornography, and I have so much more for you. I'm right here. I just need you to reach out, right?

unknown 1:02:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:35

And uh I started doing that. I went through like an addiction recovery program and through counseling for many years. And honestly, if somebody would have asked me, like, hey, you know, or told me one day you'll be free from porn, I would have laughed at them in the face. I would have been like, Yeah, there's no way I'm free from this. And now I am. And it's absolutely wild to even say that because I would have completely disagreed with anybody that would have said that before.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:03

Was your porn addiction was that before or after the onset of symptoms?

SPEAKER_00 1:03:09

Like so I was exposed to it, I think, around nine or ten. And I had like an on-again, off again relationship with it. I think it was pretty heavy in high school. And there were some reasons for that. And I'll get into that, you know, in my podcast and stuff. I won't. No, I would talk for way too long if I got into that now. But the the one thing that I think was difficult was that I dealt with my pain in an unhealthy way early on, was I dealt with it by disassociation.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:42

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:43

And then pornography was a really easy outlet for that.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:46

For sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:47

So I would then disassociate because in those moments I wasn't feeling pain, right? I was feeling pleasure, and I wanted that because I didn't want to feel pain.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:54

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:55

And, you know, it took that realization of like instead of me having that low self-worth and valuing myself as less than because I placed so much value on what society told me mattered, that I started seeing myself the way that God sees me, is that I am a child, I am a creation of God, I am a co-heir with Christ, and I'm infinitely valuable in his eyes. And that change, I would say, was like really pivotal. And, you know, it gave me that, you know, that sense of gratitude that I talked about earlier, where it's like, you know, I'm I'm so grateful that God even blesses me with another day, and I want to utilize it the best way that I can. And how can I use that to glorify him? How can I tell other people about him? And, you know, I used to look at my accident as a bless uh as a curse, and then I started seeing it as a blessing because in the summertime, you know, wear shorts, my leg is visible and it doesn't look like a normal leg. So people are like, hey, what happened? And I get to share with them what happened and say, you know, I deal with this horrible chronic pain diagnosis, and I can relate to physical pain probably better than most people can.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:04

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:04

But I know somebody that dealt with more pain than that, and that's Jesus, and he did it because he loves you.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:08

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:09

And then I get to talk with them about Jesus, and it's such an easy opportunity for me to share the gospel.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:14

That's so cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:16

And then I'm like, okay, God, I can kind of see what you're doing with this. And I was like, okay, that is an easy blessing because talking about what happened, I would say, is where you know you're inviting people into your life and being real with them and kind of breaking down those barriers rather than being like, hey, Jesus loves you, you should believe in him. Right. Which is fine, you know. But I think that it's it's more impactful if you have like a relationship with them or build rapport with them or share your story with them too, and be like, you know, and then that that'll stick with somebody. And you never know who it's going to touch.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:48

Yeah. That's so beautiful. So your pain had led you to disassociation with pornography. And then the truth of who God sees you as, which isn't a disabled person a disabled person, but his son, and whom he is very delighted in. And he sees you that way because of the atonement of Christ, the way that he took your pain for you, he took your Punishment for you, died on the cross, rose from the dead, forgave you of that, and gave you the title of his son, of an heir that he he deeply loves and is proud of, even. That really changed you. That helped you to see, all right, like I can be grateful because I'm not defined by my addiction, I'm not defined by my pain, I'm defined by God.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:41

No, and I think that that's like the lie of Satan is Satan calls you your actions, right? Oh, you're a pornographer, oh you're a disabled person. Whoa, and right, and God calls you what you are, which is his.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:55

Yeah. Wow, and that's on unconditional love. That's so good. Absolutely that's so good. Well, Ben, it has been an absolute pleasure and delight to have you here. Likewise. I'm I'm so excited for your podcast, Tried by Fire. Everybody should check it out. And yeah, of course, when it comes out, I'll try to link it below, or you guys can go to my website and perhaps Ben will have a profile on there that you can go see his link to his Tried by Fire podcast. But yeah, I'm super excited to hear more of your story. I certainly feel very encouraged after interviewing you. So thanks for your transparency, your honesty, absolutely, and for giving the glory to God. I am very inspired. So thanks for that, Ben.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:41

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:43

Thank you so much for being a part of the Christians with Chronic Illnesses community. Please remember to follow Rate and subscribe to the show. You can also follow us on our

Sharing Hope And Closing

SPEAKER_01 1:07:51

socials at CWCI Podcast. And if you're interested in sharing your story, please email us at cwcipodcast at gmail.com. If you are interested in contributing to the production of Christians with chronic illnesses, please see the show notes below for subscriptions starting as low as $1 a month, or email us for a more direct way to give. This show is hosted and produced by Ellie Sprague, and our incredible logo, thumbnail, and overall CWCI artist is Brianna Middleton. This show is intended for entertainment and encouragement purposes only. Please talk to your doctor before trying anything you hear on this show. Until next Monday.